Primark’s Global Expansion Playbook: The Customer is the Hero

[00:01:44] Phillip: Well, hello, and welcome to Future Commerce, the podcast at the intersection of culture and commerce. I'm Phillip. And today, I am honored and excited because I get to go deep today on a brand that I don't think you would traditionally have thought about as being a cultural fixture here in The United States. They were founded originally in 1969 in Dublin, Ireland, and definitely one of those brands that has a footprint in The UK and internationally. But today, I can find them at the Sawgrass Mills Mall and many other places here in The United States as they're making their mark here culturally in The United States. With me here today to talk about what they're doing and their strategy and how they are making a mark here in The States and beyond is Rene Federico, who is The US head of Marketing at Primark, leading the international retailers first major marketing push in America after a decade of organic growth and has spent over twenty years at corporations like Nike and Converse, including serving as the global VP of Direct Marketing for Converse. Welcome to the show, Rene.

[00:03:12] Rene Federico: Thanks so much, Phillip. I'm super happy to be here.

[00:03:15] Phillip: I'm super happy to have you too. Today, I think we want to talk about a wide range of topics. I think we want to talk a little bit about The US strategy and global strategy. I think we want to talk a bit about your background and what you're bringing to the role. I think we want to talk about the current climate and the culture that we're in right now and how Primark is fitting into the cultural shifts. And then obviously there's what all of our global leadership that listens to and watches the Future Commerce show is really trying to steer through, which is we have pricing concerns, consumer confidence concerns, tariffs, supply chain, those sorts of things. But before we get into any of those today, you did spend twenty years at Nike and Converse. What drew you to Primark? And for those not familiar with the brand, you have this brand obsession with culture. How are you bringing that to the role?

[00:04:14] Rene Federico: I mean, it's a great question. What drew me to Primark really, as you mentioned at the top of the show, is really Primark is a brand that has a ton of momentum globally. Very well known in in The UK and in Ireland and throughout Europe as a fixture for and a destination for style. It's a brand that folks in those markets grew up with and have a connection to and a perspective on. And so I was really drawn to the opportunity to be able to participate in the growth of this brand here in The US. And it's interesting. It's not, although Nike and Converse do participate in the style and fashion and streetwear conversation, those brands have different focuses. And Primark is really about creating a culture that is bringing that accessibility, that joy of shopping, those messages of value and affordability to The US consumer. So while we're maybe obsessed with landing different messages with customers, there is still a drive to be able to create that connectivity between brands and individuals and help them understand what our proposition is. And I felt that Primark was a place I could have an outsized impact where I can take what I've learned over the course of my career, which actually started on the retail sales floor. I do have a really connection to the importance that stores and store experiences and store associates play the role of helping to find a brand and connecting brands with customers. But really that, you know, the accessibility and the joy that Primark is able to deliver, making the connection between that and meeting US consumer needs.

[00:06:30] Phillip: I have to think about your particular set of skills and the years that you spent working with an iconic brand like Converse. When I think of Converse, I think of one of the most iconic brands, one of the most iconic silhouettes in the world at one of the lowest price points. I don't think you can ever get as much style for as good of a price. And it's still to this day. And I think that's something to be said about, you know, this intersection of value with an iconic brand and a history of brands that become much larger than just one silhouette. It becomes a cultural fixture. And that's where your role now is US Head of Marketing, you can bring that perspective. Is there something about your prior experience that maybe you've learned in your role? You said retail sales experience certainly has a bearing there. I'm sure CX and in person definitely has some. But what about your role of understanding how brand in The US and people's emotional resonance with brand comes into it. What's your reaction to your perspective there, especially with a value based customer?

[00:07:58] Rene Federico: Yeah, I think often I really do feel that there is, you know, I'm deeply passionate about the fact that when you can bring a level of relevance to your brand in a consumer's mind, then that is the job to be done. You know? On the spectrum of winning the wallet and winning the heart and mind, certainly there's a lot of tactics that exist on that spectrum, but you really do have to land some sort of way for a customer or consumer to orient to your brand. They they have to be connected in some way. And I think the value of that, honestly, Phillip, is that then you become less interchangeable with all the other choices they have out there because there is a difference in terms of what will drive them to participate with you. So a lot of brands can offer value. You know, even looking at the examples you gave in terms of Converse, a lot of brands can offer an affordable sneaker. Does it have the same reverence? Does it have the same, does it stand for the same creativity? Does it give the same messages of creativity? Does it allow you to self express in the same ways? Right? So those are all a manifestation of the emotional connections between brands and customers. So it is about that storytelling and whether you can make that storytelling relevant to your customer.

[00:09:37] Phillip: Well said. Yeah.

[00:09:38] Rene Federico: And so I think that was our opportunity with Primark where you mentioned again and I mentioned as well, there's a legacy that we're really proud of with this brand that exists in The UK and Ireland, certainly, and also in Europe. We're not building on that same legacy, that fifty year legacy. What we're doing today is we're telling that story and certainly acknowledging that, but putting perspective for The US consumer and say, "Hey. This is about relatability. What cultural connections can we make? How do we make sure our message of quality and style and affordability land in a way that is not interchangeable with other brands?" So there's some agility in that, certainly, but I think, you know, the magic and the power of brands that come top of mind that you won't trade in and out for, that you constantly seek out their products, that you have a lot of trust in, that is because you're connected to those brands beyond the transactional.

[00:10:42] Phillip: Yeah. I think that's such a keen way of saying it because we're in this time now where I think so much of the brand exposure that people see in, say, their social media feed is based on direct response. Right? "I have a problem." "I have a solution to that problem." It's either sort of impulse value based. Right? That's, you know, I'm making a decision right now. For instance, I there's a whole generational cohort of people right now, Renee, that shop entirely on TikTok shop, entirely TikTok live. That's their programming of choice. And it really, to me, speaks to just a different sort of approach to brand building and brands that start now of thinking, you know, brand leaders that are in talents that are being grown right now that are all they really focus on is the tactic of closing the sale, but not necessarily building a brand. And I think that when you when we're thinking about this stewarding a generational brand like Primark, you have a much larger responsibility, especially understanding and inheriting not just a legacy, but you're inhabiting different cultural ideals. So I'd love to speak a little bit too... Primark's been here in The States for ten years. I'd love to know, you know, what what the current push is now, what the focus is now, what your aim is here in the last, like, twelve, twenty four months. And how does that differ from, you know, the The US ideals versus, say, The UK, Ireland, Europe, European ideals? Are they different strategies? Are they different merchandising?

[00:12:36] Rene Federico: First of all, a couple of things. I think you're right. I was nodding emphatically to the point you're making at the top of the question, which is there is a real intangible, I think just in marketing in general right now, there and deserves to be. It's certainly super relevant, but just an obsession with data and efficiency and how are we, you know, return on and metrics and and all those things. And it must exist. Right? I mean, I think it's so helpful. I also think, though, that we've lost a little bit of the importance of equity and long term value and the ability to drive those connections because those things become sustainable terms of they are the things you go back to when you need to reset or look at new opportunities or when some nameless device or product on TikTok shop is kinda eating your lunch. You have to go back to this. Do we have equity in our brand? What's the long term value? Where can we reset? So I think there's two things there. You can't measure everything on a thirty day dashboard and make all your decisions as a brand because those are indicators, but those are chase factors. So that's stat chasing. I often think of sport, I often frame a lot of things in sport because I was very, very, very close to that industry for essentially my entire career and also was an athlete. And so you can stat chase, or you can build strategies that help you win as a team. And the outcomes will be different depending on your approach. And if you blend those things perfectly, I think you have a real recipe for success. You know, in terms of look, our brand has been in The US for a decade, and we have slowly grown as a very trusted destination brand for style choices, for trends, for quality, and for items that offer a lot of value and are very affordable. Right now, we need to be more relevant, so we need to be more visible. We're starting to grow our footprint in very important markets like in the New York Metro Area. And so our concentration of stores is really opening up the opportunity to tell our story to more people and get more people to experience our brand. Differences between what we do with The UK and The US, again, is sometimes we have to introduce ourselves, tell our story, be able to ensure that a customer can see themselves and what we have to offer, make sure they know how to get their hands on our product and get them to a location. There's a lot encompassed in that, where again, I think an approach in The UK says, "The basis that all that exists in terms of brand awareness and, and an understanding of the brand proposition, you can really spend more time on the storytelling piece. I think we have to create a balance between how are we just getting in the path of, of customers and potential customers and making sure that we are driving some sort some sort of intent or interest in our brand that we can further with them.

[00:16:19] Phillip: So this is a, I don't wanna say the the basest sense. As a decade old brand, to some degree, you should have, you know, a pretty strong base built here in The States, especially in some regions. Right? So you're you're a global brand. Some of that work's done for you. So when you're doing, you know, a campaign, a lot of this if you are spending, I'm not sure if you are, maybe that's something you speak to. But if let's say that you are spending in performance or you're doing some email marketing retention, a lot of these things return back in spades because you have a lot of the groundwork laid for you. So the return on brand investment makes everything more efficient over time. It's the  challenge that many leaders face today is the the performance dollars, especially in trying to chase growth, is that the they sense that maybe the chasing of growth has a diminishing impact to the investment that they have made in brand over time. And so do you think that there's a balance there? Because I know this is an age old question. Nobody's going to actually solve it. But, you know, you're in a marketing role. I'm curious if you have a perspective on how much you balance performance versus brand investment and how you delineate that in your organization.

[00:17:57] Rene Federico: Yeah. There certainly needs to be a balance. And I think really getting sharp on what your opportunity is in the market and then being able to engineer that in such a way that it's supporting your overall enterprise objectives for growth. And that goes back to, again, there's you could probably identify some areas of growth and get out and chase them, but you have to understand what the trade offs are for that. And you could ignore all those areas of growth and just focus on the capital b brand equity or brand energy and really not see a lot of tangible returns. So certainly, I think integrating those strategies is really vitally important.

[00:18:48] Phillip: Do you have an example of a couple things that you might advise other people on? Like, what are some examples of those investments of strategies that might fall into those different buckets in your mind?

[00:20:02] Rene Federico: Sure. Well, I was gonna say too, Phillip, it's I think that that's that's sort of changed, and that's a challenge that I mean, count me in the group that's looking for advice, which is the funnel is different for a lot of reasons. And so I think that you have mechanisms or tactics that used to clearly fit in top, mid, and lower.

[00:20:33] Phillip: Yep.

[00:20:33] Rene Federico: And now because just because of all sorts of circumstances and factors, external and the way brands are approaching things and the way the consumer dynamic, consumer mindsets, and also just in general, how consumers interact with brands, that has changed because there's many more platforms now. The power of social commerce, the power of digitally native sort of super center type shopping has changed what we do. And so an example of that is it used to be that you could count, you know, social, just social media as a mid to lower depending if it was performance, you know, based social media or mid tier with influencers. Now that is top. That's top funnel. That's mid funnel. That's lower funnel, and it converts. So it literally, there's commerce. It's commerce enabled. So I think the approach has to more be about, "Hey. How do we create an ecosystem for consumers and make sure that they can operate really fish efficiently within it? And what messages are we serving to them at the right point in time? When do we need to be about projecting our brand message, and when do we need to get out of the way and just let them find what they want? And I think there's a much more interesting conversation around that than trying to say, "Hey. Let's line up a bunch of tactics And make sure that that that we can sort of advocate for them in a strategic plan framework.

[00:22:22] Phillip: Totally. Astute long term viewers of future commerce. I think we're in the, let's say, 400 plus episodes these days. I don't know. We've been around for nine years now, Renee, who's counting. But I think we're at this place where many people will remember that we've been saying no one's context is the same from business to business. So tactics are usually not repeatable and from context to context. And so I don't think it's a terribly interesting conversation to talk about, like, what tactic is working for what retail, you know, organization to what retail organization. The way that you employ creators in one organization may not work for another. I just had this conversation with the Head of US Product over at TikTok last week... Emily Anderson, also Boston based. But we have this interesting conversation around creators as a full funnel, you know, mechanism and being deployed all across the funnel, brand awareness, you know, mid funnel, like engagement, like getting people engaged in, like you said, likes, shares, comments. And then just some people are using NDR, like actually just getting them to convert and others are using it for retention. Like we can use creators and retention campaigns now. That mean? I think that makes creators a whole channel unto themselves. And that way you almost you need... That's a whole role unto itself. So the reason I prefaced your perspective on brand and performance is because I really want to dive into this first US brand campaign called That's So Primark. And I want to compare that to this idea of translating the European retail joy of Primark for American audiences?

[00:24:23] Rene Federico: That creative platform was developed out of some insights and manifesto work that we did around, one acknowledging that the joy of shopping in Primark that is inherent in how customers describe us in The UK and Ireland. And understanding how to put some words and definitions to what that is. It's finding the perfect item for the perfect occasion. It's treating yourself in the moment. It's being able to afford everything that you're shopping for without feeling you have to compromise. Right? It is this sort of it's visceral in that there is a joy to shopping that we wanted to almost reintroduce to The US consumer, that it was an invitation to our customers to experience that joy, to experience what it means to love your closet, what it means to be able to look like a million bucks, but only have to spend 20. Right? So that's where that sort of joy and discovery kinda came in, and that was our ability to kinda take that sentiment and really translate it for US consumers, really kind of capturing that feeling, and doing that without having to compromise. I think a lot of what tends to happen is that there is an ask of the US consumer to have to compromise. Either if you wanna get something for an affordable price, it has to be last season's styles and trends. If you want to be able to shop for everything you need, you have to wait for some predetermined discount cycle or event.

[00:26:26] Phillip: Right.

[00:26:27] Rene Federico: We wanted to convey that we can offer that joy and it is our everyday proposition for The US customer and make it feel US based and the style references relevant to our consumer and the music references relevant to our consumer. And it is the type of thing where, you know, there's a universal truth, I think, to the joy of shopping. And there is also this idea that there's such a uniqueness and a voice our brand has in that, that it is expressed through saying, "That's so Primark." They're like, "Oh, you got those jeans? Like, $12? That's so Primark." Or "You look great for this occasion." That's something that we can deliver through through that messaging.

[00:29:15] Phillip: I love that with that as the basis and understanding the... You said manifesto. Love that as the word because it sets the tone and the basis and the system of belief by which you express everything else. Right?

[00:30:19] Rene Federico: Yep.

[00:30:21] Phillip: "That's so Primark," being almost, you said also the word platform. I think platform is another word on which you can build things that to me makes more sense than by which you interpret all of these other extension campaigns that you've seen since. So just to riff off a few of them, there's I think "Heaven is a place like Primark," which is an interesting way to see sort of you get sort of Belinda Carlyle of it all, which to me sort of evokes this very relevant tap into nostalgia, right along with I think there was a television media buy on that. Right?

[00:31:12] Rene Federico: Yup. There was.

[00:31:12] Phillip: So that I think that that's incredibly relevant. And then I think there was a a recent denim campaign that I think it was "In Denim We Can," something like that?

[00:31:28] Rene Federico: Yes.

[00:31:29] Phillip: Which I think also to be commended, denim having a moment and sort of having this, you know, whatever I want to call it sort of this patriotism infused moment here in The United States, I don't know what to call it. That seems extraordinarily culturally relevant because it sort of has that tenor about it as well, but in a Primark infused way. In Denim We Can. It seems to be your way of expressing that moment. And that's very recent, I think. That's within the last month or so.

[00:32:04] Rene Federico: Yes.

[00:32:04] Phillip: That campaign. How are you coming up with these extensions with your "That's so Primark" at the center?

[00:32:12] Rene Federico: So our approach really has been one to, again, making sure that we're able to identify that feeling that we're trying to evoke first and foremost. And we're not trying to, you know, chase commerciality or chase some other trend or creative application. So again, it's really been about how do we express joy? How do we drive this notion of that feeling like, when you fall in love with a garment, it really is like a visceral way to approach how we can bring across a style message because it's so personal. Style, self expression, fashion, the ability to find things that not only that you want, that you can afford, that you feel are going to last you for a while, but, you know, there's also they make you feel more confident. They make you feel taken care of in some way. They make you feel comfortable. And so I think it's always been about how do we make sure that we can be true to the how this message lands emotionally and still have it feel celebratory of our products and draw in customers in a way that's interesting and engaging?

[00:33:41] Phillip: You said City Street.

[00:33:43] Rene Federico: Yeah.

[00:33:44] Phillip: Herald Square, that's your flagship. Right?

[00:33:47] Rene Federico: It will be. Herald Square is set to open in '26, and it'll be a very important store for us in a very important market. I mean, New York is an epicenter globally, not just in The United States. And the area in Herald Square where we'll be located is iconic from a retailer standpoint.

[00:34:10] Phillip: Oh for sure.

[00:34:11] Rene Federico: So to be on that street in New York, I think it's a signal to the US consumer that we matter in this conversation in a way that our stores, we're so proud of our store estate and all the people that help make it exceptional that work throughout our stores in The US. But this store will help sort of anchor a different level of importance for our brand in The US.

[00:34:38] Phillip: Yeah. 54,000 square foot or so, oh, according to Gemini. You can correct me here. And I think it's replacing the old Navy that used to be there or thereabouts.

[00:34:52] Rene Federico: It's a store we plan to activate actually, honestly, Phillip, quite a bit at. I think it is our opportunity to to get in front of more audiences, more often and really activate more. You know, I think one of the things that Nike and Converse do exceptionally well is they find their consumers at the points at which... They find ways to connect with them authentically through activations.

[00:35:21] Phillip: Yeah.

[00:35:22] Rene Federico: Not just through media, not just through platforms and channels, but activating in ways that create that brand relevance. And as we were saying before that consumers don't shop your org chart, they shop your brand. And so they don't care how you do things. And business models don't shop, customers do. Right? So those two sort of soundbitey things are always floating around in my head. And just to say, how can we get out in front of people and find ways to have them experience our brand that isn't so one dimensional?

[00:35:57] Phillip: When I think of Primark, obviously a retail fixture. I think of it as sort of offline first. And in that way the media function of Primark is the store is the media function. It serves as like both the billboard, it's the community hall, it's the treasure hunt... There is a nontransactional impact of a store visit in that it serves as its own brand awareness and its own content creation. It's its own to make a statement in a flagship store in such an important retail neighborhood, I think, is a really important statement for the brand. I can't wait to see what you do with it. I can't wait to see it myself. So, yeah, I'd love to come through.

[00:36:50] Rene Federico: Great.

[00:36:51] Phillip: Because I think cultural geography is a really important step for a brand like this too. I also, you touched on it. Is there something around the, you know, performance and athlete culture that you think guided your prior experience? There is this tribe and belonging that sneakerheads have or that performance and athletes have that maybe Primark shoppers also share, but it's expressed in a different way. How do you bring those ideals along with you in this role?

[00:37:25] Rene Federico: Absolutely. The first way I would say is just a belief in your own potential.

[00:37:31] Phillip: Mhmm.

[00:37:31] Rene Federico: That I think is so powerful. There is a forum for it. You know, obviously working for an athletic company is just you're always saying like, "Hey, there's a goal to chase, and do you believe enough in yourself to go chase it?" And I would say that that mindset exists throughout Primark as well, which is great because, I mean, I spent my whole career, up until now at Nike from my very first job on the retail sales floor was at a Nike store through the positions I held through the Converse brand. And so that was very familiar to me, as I mentioned, as an athlete.

[00:38:13] Phillip: What was the sport?

[00:38:13] Rene Federico: I would identify as a basketball player, but I also played soccer and softball. Yeah, I'm just passionate about basketball. But I didn't know if it existed in other places because I never worked anywhere else. So it was so inspiring to me to see it how it existed here in Primark through a different prism. But I love that idea of, first and foremost, do you believe enough in your own potential to chase bold ideas and to put in the work and also try things and and have the courage to show up in your role and to the best of your capacity? And I would say the second thing is really this desire almost to reset the bar. And again, I found that throughout my career, which is that's what you did, but what now, what are you doing? And so and again, really finding that in the culture here at Primark, again, through a different prism because sport does give you a great background to use as inspiration. But really in terms of what we do and how dedicated we are to our customer here at Primark, the idea that excellence exists is sort of universally accepted. But the fact that that as soon as we reach a bar, we want to improve and raise it is core to who we are. I think it really resonates with me and something I believe kinda helps keep you innovating and things like that.

[00:39:51] Phillip: I think innovation such a interesting word to use, and in the brand culture at Nike, I have to believe that experimentation and innovation, it's like core values, but it's expensive. It's probably high stakes. And Primark, you have this democratic and price sensitive approach to innovation, I'm sure. How is the value driven retail model innovation, you know, how does that differ? How is it same? Are there parallels or are there differences to the way that you approach innovation in the marketing sense? How have you observed it?

[00:40:35] Rene Federico: Absolutely. A lot of parallels. You know, think innovation is a mindset, first and foremost, and that's probably a little bit cringey to say, but it really is because it can happen in so many different contexts that we tend to take it and put it into this really futuristic kind of context in this really sort of it has to be about reinvention and high stakes and high investment. But I think we're innovating every day. One great driver of innovation is limited resources.

[00:41:18] Phillip: So true.

[00:41:20] Rene Federico: When you really have to make choices or you have a goal or an objective in mind and you don't wanna compromise, that drives a significant amount of innovation. So I would say in the context, being a brand of I mean, just our paradigm, just affordability, quality, and style. That in and of itself is a prism that will drive innovation because the two out of three model think might apply. You might say to yourself, you can get two, but you can't get the third. You'd have to sacrifice the third if you pick two and sacrifice the third. But we're committed to delivering all three. And so that drives a tremendous amount of innovation, certainly in how we market it, certainly in how we look at the opportunity in The US business and certainly with our teams in Dublin. You know where you know where I look, you know, just personally for exceptional examples of innovation is kids. And I don't have my own kids, but I've coached kids. I was a kid once, you know? So I think that they are great examples of innovation at work on a daily basis. And so what I would say about innovation is it depends on how you approach it. And whether you, if you believe it sits in sort of this kind of walled off, if you believe that it isn't accessible to everyone, then you're not likely to really participate in it. But if innovation is like air. It is should be what you breathe. It should be what, it should be in everything that you do. And t really isn't dictated by any sort of level of access or resource.

[00:43:27] Phillip: As we're sort of coming up on time, I feel like I could talk to you for hours here. We'll have to have you back at some point.

[00:43:35] Rene Federico: Same here.

[00:43:36] Phillip: We have this perspective here around what we do today having these generational impacts, cultural impacts. I really, truly believe that if you can influence what people buy, you sort of shape who they become. And in some ways, then people who guide and shape retail businesses are the most important cultural leaders to impact here. I'm curious, who do you look up to? Are there other people in the industry? Are there other brands? Are there folks that you think are exemplars? There's plenty of bad examples.

[00:44:27] Phillip: Sure.

[00:44:27] Rene Federico: I'm sure. What are the ones you think are good examples that you think are worth looking up to?

[00:44:34] Rene Federico: Compliments to the brands I've worked for in the past. I think that there's two brands there that are truly dedicated to an approach that helps enable their customer to participate with their brand in some way, whether it's through the power of sport or through the power of creativity and self expression, I think that's a great way to orient in terms of being an enabler. And I would say, you know, the Primark brand as well, which is a transparent brand, which is great to see as well. A brand that says, "We're putting in front of our customer a transparent and honest opportunity to shop with us, to participate in what our proposition is around those three things, to be able to be on trend, find style, fashion, feel confident that it's affordable, and feel confident that it's quality." Other than that, I think the people are the hero here. You know what I mean, Phillip? It really is that. Because you're right. When you get someone to buy something, that is an exertion of power. It means somewhere in their conscience, you've been able to affect a choice. And so I think that we're in a moment where the customer is the hero of the story and that we need to continue to kind of find ways to not only solve problems and help them be able to do whatever it is that they're trying to do, do whatever it is that your brand enables, but also just kind of participate with them in more ways than one. And so I think there's an opportunity for brands to really get back to that sort of full participation with customers. And it really is okay if there are some things that sit purely in a transactional space and that are unencumbered by being more than that. But I really do think there's space here to drive more meaning between brands and consumers. And I would say that's, I think that there's an evolution happening, to be able to redefine what that looks like in the context of today's marketplace.

[00:47:02] Phillip: Ohh. That's the most phenomenal way to answer that because that's how we approach it too is there's, you know, power dynamics in the business that we're in, and we should treat it with respect and we should treat it with a great deal of care that this job has a phenomenal responsibility associated with it and that the customers deserve us to treat it with the responsibility that it's due. And to that point, I think you really get it. It's just been such a pleasure. I'm so glad to have had you here. I wish we could have gotten to the whole docket. An hour is just not enough. But we'll have to have you back to speak a little bit more. And I can't wait to meet in person. I have to come by. Thank you so much. And once again, Rene Federico is The US Head of Marketing over at Primark. Would love for you guys to go and check out what they are doing. I think they're onto something big here, and it sounds like the leadership really understands where things are going. Thank you so much, Rene, for joining Future Comments.

[00:48:14] Rene Federico: Thanks for having me, Phillip.